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Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
2084
   |
Posted - 2013.05.19 21:58:00 -
[1] - Quote
The real question is what that 2 billion could buy you in the game if PLEXes cost that much. The price of a PLEX coincides pretty well with about two hours of minimum wage work in most first-world nations, and also coincides with about two-three hours of grinding the most profitable activities in the game (high-sec incursions, wormhole sleepers, null anomalies).
You'll never really be able to shift this equation. So, does it matter how much a PLEX actually costs in-game?
I wrote some true EVE stories! And no, they're not of the generic "my 0.0 alliance had lots of 0.0 fleets and took a lot of 0.0 space" sort. Check them out here:
https://truestories.eveonline.com/users/2074-destiny-corrupted |
Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
2085
|
Posted - 2013.05.20 01:47:00 -
[2] - Quote
Corey Fumimasa wrote:Destiny Corrupted wrote:The real question is what that 2 billion could buy you in the game if PLEXes cost that much. The price of a PLEX coincides pretty well with about two hours of minimum wage work in most first-world nations, and also coincides with about two-three hours of grinding the most profitable activities in the game (high-sec incursions, wormhole sleepers, null anomalies).
You'll never really be able to shift this equation. So, does it matter how much a PLEX actually costs in-game? CCP can do whatever they want with the price of PLEX. If they wanted to give more value to a PLEX they could just include a T3 cruiser with every one. If they wanted to lower the ISK price for PLEX they would just have to start seeding them here and there. In the first case the price of all items in game would start to come down as inventory went up due to these PLEX items. So PLEX would be worth even more ISK and would take longer to grind for players buying them with in game currency. In the second case the ISK price for PLEX would go down as supply went up. CCP has never done this, but it wouldn't be difficult if they decided to. My price of 2 bil is based on the point in time that I would like to see positive cash flow from a PLEX investment. Also just the value I currently place on in game goods. The idea of comparing RL work time to in game ISK grind time wasn't part of my breakdown.
Actually, the PLEX is almost a completely inelastic good. It's usually bought on a just-in-time basis, and the price isn't a factor for people who wouldn't otherwise pay cash subs anyway. They either afford the PLEX, or don't play.
If CCP bundles other crap with PLEXes without raising their cash price, the price of PLEXes would probably go down due to the much-increased supply. In fact it would probably go down to the point where the value of the PLEX and the value of its bundled items would together be equivalent to the value of a PLEX today. People would be buying more PLEXes from CCP due to the bundled stuff until the price reaches equilibrium.
If CCP seeds PLEXes, then the price would indeed go down, as long as CCP prices them aggressively. Since this would create a pretty big ISK sink, it would have a double effect: first because of CCP selling PLEXes for less ISK, and second because this would cause deflation, pushing all prices down.
But in either case I think that $15 charged by CCP would be equivalent to about 2-3 hours of high-end pve in-game. If CCP releases incursions 2.0 tomorrow and you can suck 500 million an hour from them, you can bet your ass that PLEXes would be pushing 2 billion within two weeks. Everything else would rise in price accordingly.
I wrote some true EVE stories! And no, they're not of the generic "my 0.0 alliance had lots of 0.0 fleets and took a lot of 0.0 space" sort. Check them out here:
https://truestories.eveonline.com/users/2074-destiny-corrupted |
Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
2090
|
Posted - 2013.05.20 06:58:00 -
[3] - Quote
Corey Fumimasa wrote:There's nothing to stop CCP from buying the excess back off of the market themselves though. And because the PLEX already came with a bunch of value they only need to buy back enough to get the ISK price to its old level of 500 mil adjusted.
If CCP did this and someone found out, it would be the biggest gaming shitstorm since the release of Superman 64.
I wrote some true EVE stories! And no, they're not of the generic "my 0.0 alliance had lots of 0.0 fleets and took a lot of 0.0 space" sort. Check them out here:
https://truestories.eveonline.com/users/2074-destiny-corrupted |
Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
2090
|
Posted - 2013.05.20 07:20:00 -
[4] - Quote
Because they'd be injecting money into the economy without anyone spending time to actually make it. It's the very definition of "pay to win" because you're literally buying "win" from the developers.
Now I'm not saying that CCP doesn't already do this, or that they might not do it in the future. I'm just saying that if they did it, and we found out, the community would not respond kindly.
Oh, and on top of that, it would mean that they're basically grabbing money. The purchased PLEXes were intended for players, so now more PLEXes would need to be bought, or game time instead, in order to satisfy subscription needs. It would mean CCP is literally printing dollas for itself without providing goods or services. This would probably be illegal.
I wrote some true EVE stories! And no, they're not of the generic "my 0.0 alliance had lots of 0.0 fleets and took a lot of 0.0 space" sort. Check them out here:
https://truestories.eveonline.com/users/2074-destiny-corrupted |
Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
2091
|
Posted - 2013.05.20 08:18:00 -
[5] - Quote
They'd be selling ISK for money. Considering how they advertise their game as having a "fully player-driven economy," one could potentially make a case out of the [fact] that they're not delivering on their promise. Shaky legal ground, sure, but the possibility is there depending on how good the lawyers are. They could, of course, simply change the game's description, and then they'd be fully covered.
Either way, it probably wouldn't matter, since they'd lose tens of thousands of customers when word of this got out. It would be quite a bit worse than Monoclegate.
I wrote some true EVE stories! And no, they're not of the generic "my 0.0 alliance had lots of 0.0 fleets and took a lot of 0.0 space" sort. Check them out here:
https://truestories.eveonline.com/users/2074-destiny-corrupted |
Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
2091
|
Posted - 2013.05.20 11:39:00 -
[6] - Quote
I'll let someone else respond to that because I'm way too courteous for the language required in order to do so.
(@Corey)
I wrote some true EVE stories! And no, they're not of the generic "my 0.0 alliance had lots of 0.0 fleets and took a lot of 0.0 space" sort. Check them out here:
https://truestories.eveonline.com/users/2074-destiny-corrupted |
Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
2095
|
Posted - 2013.05.20 12:19:00 -
[7] - Quote
I might not have "rights" in the sense of actual ownership of the contents of my hangars, but CCP sure as hell won't endanger my ability to use those items as I see fit within the confines of the game's rule set. They can transgress on that unspoken pact if they wish, but then Kotaku articles get written, and honorable businessmen cut their stomachs with butter knives.
I wrote some true EVE stories! And no, they're not of the generic "my 0.0 alliance had lots of 0.0 fleets and took a lot of 0.0 space" sort. Check them out here:
https://truestories.eveonline.com/users/2074-destiny-corrupted |
Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
2098
|
Posted - 2013.05.20 12:57:00 -
[8] - Quote
Stop...Stop...*cries*
Can't you see he's already dead?
I wrote some true EVE stories! And no, they're not of the generic "my 0.0 alliance had lots of 0.0 fleets and took a lot of 0.0 space" sort. Check them out here:
https://truestories.eveonline.com/users/2074-destiny-corrupted |
Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
2098
|
Posted - 2013.05.20 13:04:00 -
[9] - Quote
But aren't they buying the PLEXes from CCP to sell them for ISK on the market in order to use the ISK to buy battleships in the first place?
I wrote some true EVE stories! And no, they're not of the generic "my 0.0 alliance had lots of 0.0 fleets and took a lot of 0.0 space" sort. Check them out here:
https://truestories.eveonline.com/users/2074-destiny-corrupted |
Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
2098
|
Posted - 2013.05.20 13:08:00 -
[10] - Quote
Danni stark wrote:Corey Fumimasa wrote:It wouldn't. Those battleships would never have been bought off of the market anyway because the person using PLEX to buy them probably doesn't have time to grind all the ISK anyway. All it does is create more potential for PVP as players who just couldn't afford to PvP in battleships before can now give it a try. not sure if trolling, or completely clueless.
He's not clueless, he's just really good at what he does.
Anyways, I'm leaving now to go read some Ayn Rand to sixth graders at my local public library. See y'all in a couple of hours.
I wrote some true EVE stories! And no, they're not of the generic "my 0.0 alliance had lots of 0.0 fleets and took a lot of 0.0 space" sort. Check them out here:
https://truestories.eveonline.com/users/2074-destiny-corrupted |
Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
2106
|
Posted - 2013.05.20 21:24:00 -
[11] - Quote
Murk Paradox wrote:Corey Fumimasa wrote:TL/DR Cost of PLEX will go down for people PLEXing their accounts if CCP includes some goods with the purchase of a PLEX. Cost in regards to isk as the method of payment? Yes, the value of the isk will go down with the prices of plex.
The value of ISK wouldn't go down, but the value of the bundled items and the components required in their construction would.
Anyways, Corey, let me put things into perspective for you to help answer the OP through my viewpoint. I'm an unemployed college grad who spends his time going to interviews, taking care of my demented grandmother, and ship toasting on these forums. I have very little disposable income.
What I do have, after playing for almost a decade, is an EVE net worth somewhere between 1-2 trillion ISK. So, now more than ever, I'm required to PLEX my accounts if I want to play (although I'm thinking of re-subbing a really old account just out of tradition, and because I perceive CCP as making a few correct moves, such as tags4sec). Yet if PLEXes rose to 2 billion a piece, I'd probably stop playing, since I can't be assed to grind enough money every month to keep a few accounts going, and would rather quickly run out of cash and liquid assets as well. Hell, I haven't touched pve content since 2006, and am breaking even/making a small profit just from pvp alone. In a few months/years, I'd have to start selling critical assets just to keep playing. Now, if that's my response to such a situation, consider what a person who doesn't have this degree of wealth, or my experience with the game, would do.
I'm not the only jobless EVE player around. There would be an exodus of people, and you'd hardly be able to replace them with enough wall-street types who can drop a Benjamin on game bucks every week. It would be catastrophic.
Now, all of this assumes that the value of ISK wouldn't decrease with an increase in the price of PLEXes (that is, a 2-billion-ISK PLEX in the future would be equivalent to a 2-billion-ISK PLEX today, and not a 500-million-ISK PLEX today).
I wrote some true EVE stories! And no, they're not of the generic "my 0.0 alliance had lots of 0.0 fleets and took a lot of 0.0 space" sort. Check them out here:
https://truestories.eveonline.com/users/2074-destiny-corrupted |
Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
2106
|
Posted - 2013.05.20 21:32:00 -
[12] - Quote
Oh and just for the record, I do agree that CCP probably manipulates the market in some ways. They'd be crazy not to skim some extra cash, since there are literally no oversight mechanisms that could expose their actions. They could very well be buying a few hundred PLEXes every month with faked characters to fund Hilmar's premium Hakarl habit.
I wrote some true EVE stories! And no, they're not of the generic "my 0.0 alliance had lots of 0.0 fleets and took a lot of 0.0 space" sort. Check them out here:
https://truestories.eveonline.com/users/2074-destiny-corrupted |
Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
2106
|
Posted - 2013.05.20 22:17:00 -
[13] - Quote
Corey Fumimasa wrote:I'm sure CCP can figure out how to add some value to PLEX for people that buy it with real money and at the same time keep the "grind time" for those PLEXing their accounts to the same level that it is now.
They can give people gold ship paints, or silly fruit hats for the character creator or something. Cosmetic stuff that doesn't mess with the economy, but gives "value." I'm not against that. Heck, I might buy a PLEX to get a fancy fruit hat. Or cat ears.
But I'd quit the game for good if it gave me a normal Megathron.
Corey Fumimasa wrote: I think the model would be better if it was a bit more equal, or even a bit shifted to giving players who pay real money for the game the advantage.
All trolling aside, that's not a good idea, for obvious reasons.
I wrote some true EVE stories! And no, they're not of the generic "my 0.0 alliance had lots of 0.0 fleets and took a lot of 0.0 space" sort. Check them out here:
https://truestories.eveonline.com/users/2074-destiny-corrupted |
Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
2107
|
Posted - 2013.05.20 23:11:00 -
[14] - Quote
No, I'd leave because this game would no longer be the experience I am looking for.
I wrote some true EVE stories! And no, they're not of the generic "my 0.0 alliance had lots of 0.0 fleets and took a lot of 0.0 space" sort. Check them out here:
https://truestories.eveonline.com/users/2074-destiny-corrupted |
Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
2109
|
Posted - 2013.05.21 00:28:00 -
[15] - Quote
Obunagawe wrote:Imagine if they made PLEX sellable back to CCP for, say, 50% what it costs to buy them in the first place.
We'd have people like Destiny Corrupted liquidating trillions into thousands of PLEX, price spiking to tens of billion pu, it would be GLORIOUS.
You don't need to have a PLEX buyback program in order to sell ISK for cash. How far you want to go depends entirely on your risk tolerance.
I wrote some true EVE stories! And no, they're not of the generic "my 0.0 alliance had lots of 0.0 fleets and took a lot of 0.0 space" sort. Check them out here:
https://truestories.eveonline.com/users/2074-destiny-corrupted |
Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
2110
|
Posted - 2013.05.21 01:48:00 -
[16] - Quote
Subbing an account by buying PLEXes with ISK is also considered paying for a game. The means might be different, but the act necessitates your presence as a customer for the transaction to occur. If some people didn't buy PLEXes with ISK to keep their accounts going, other people wouldn't buy PLEXes with cash to sell them on the market. It's a simple example of causality.
I wrote some true EVE stories! And no, they're not of the generic "my 0.0 alliance had lots of 0.0 fleets and took a lot of 0.0 space" sort. Check them out here:
https://truestories.eveonline.com/users/2074-destiny-corrupted |
Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
2110
|
Posted - 2013.05.21 02:02:00 -
[17] - Quote
Okay, I did, but you owe me now.
I wrote some true EVE stories! And no, they're not of the generic "my 0.0 alliance had lots of 0.0 fleets and took a lot of 0.0 space" sort. Check them out here:
https://truestories.eveonline.com/users/2074-destiny-corrupted |
Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
2111
|
Posted - 2013.05.21 11:07:00 -
[18] - Quote
Corey Fumimasa wrote:The point of the OP is that; selling PLEX this way provides more value to the players in game who are purchasing it to fund their sub. The time they have to make that ISK is also time in game interacting with the universe and learning about it.
The thing you're overlooking with that argument is that the increased value for these PLEX-buying people will come at the expense of everyone else, until a new market equilibrium is achieved. Every Megathron you give away with a PLEX means that an in-game producer of Megathrons is making less of a profit for the same amount of effort, with a portion of the profit being essentially given to the PLEX buyer.
Once again, until market equilibrium is achieved, all you'd be doing is redistributing wealth.
I wrote some true EVE stories! And no, they're not of the generic "my 0.0 alliance had lots of 0.0 fleets and took a lot of 0.0 space" sort. Check them out here:
https://truestories.eveonline.com/users/2074-destiny-corrupted |
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